Chat Archives

Chat on "Human Elephant Conflict" dated June 17, 2012

Susan Sharma: Today's chat program is cancelled as Dr.Christy could not make himself avavilable at the last minute. Sorry for the inconvenience caused to members.
John H. Eickert: Hello Susan
Susan Sharma: Hi john
Susan Sharma: Hi ritu
ritu sharma: hi susan and john...this is ritu from bangalore
John H. Eickert: Too bad about todays chat, next month?
Susan Sharma: John, would you like to tell us about your take on human elephant conflict?
Susan Sharma: Well next month we have another chat line up.
John H. Eickert: Human/elephant conflict is only an example. Elephant are large and easily visible but man has come into conflict in all environs with all of nature and has yet to learn how to live together.
Susan Sharma: Ritu, what do you say?
ritu sharma: i agree to john , its the nature the man need to understand ..
Susan Sharma: Karnataka has the largest number of wild elephants, probably. Conflict cases also abound.
Susan Sharma: Welcome ash.
ash: hi everybody
ash: my first time in the chat
ritu sharma: hi ash...
ash: hi ritu
Susan Sharma: Where are you from ash?
John H. Eickert: If space, unassailable space, can be found and granted permance then not only can the elephant exist but all the smaller, less obvious creatures and humanity will have established a legacy for generations.
John H. Eickert: Hi Ash, hi Ritu
Susan Sharma: that is a tall order, John.
ash: based in Panchkula
ash: and not directly connected with elephants
ash: but have seen a number of conflicks in the east
Susan Sharma: I guess none of us are, we are just concerned and came to learn from a biologist, who unfortunately could not come.
ash: I feel that the basic concept has to be coexistance
ash: we are also an animal
Susan Sharma: You are right, ash I agree with you.
ash: then mutually we have to give the rights
ash: hi john
John H. Eickert: Elephants have a limited ability to change how they live and their environment but many has an ifinite capacity for change.
Susan Sharma: Coexistence has to start with small animals, then we may be able to understand why elephants attack crops, why thet raid fields....
John H. Eickert: Perhaps the elephants are hungry
ash: Mahi welcome
John H. Eickert: Hello Mahi
ash: jhon everyone is hungry
Mahi Puri: hi
Mahi Puri: just trying to read up on the above to see what ive missed
John H. Eickert: Good point Ash, how can everyone be fed?
ash: and we have to give them their way
ash: we can't teach them, but if we give them proper space
ash: we coexist
ash: i think we have to mark the various conflict areas
Susan Sharma: Understanding elephant behaviour and their food habits will help humans to ward off conflict.
ritu sharma: space is very important for any animal but these conflicts happen when they dont get it...
ash: yes
ash: so we have two factors - food and space
ritu sharma: yes , agree with ash..
Rohit Pansare: hi everyone I m Rohit from Ahmedabad..
ash: hi rohit
Susan Sharma: Hi Rohit
ritu sharma: hi rohit
Rohit Pansare: @ash u've made an important point...
ash: any organisation which supports the elephants side
Susan Sharma: John, How do you deal with bear human conflict in US/ in Montana?
ash: i mean we can't keep on reducing the forest cover
Rohit Pansare: The problem of conflict is more severe near urban areas....not sure about the case of elephants...but a lot of other wildlife too
ash: Rohit you are right
John H. Eickert: When a bear encroaches it is relocated and offered a number of chances to exist but if it continues to come into conflict it is destroyed.
ash: and the problems of all the animals is same - Space
Rohit Pansare: ahmedabad-peacocks...mumbai-le0pords
ash: john i feel it not the Bear but we have encroached on their area
John H. Eickert: Yes Ash, and here in Montana the space itself is changing. The forests are drying and disappearing and within a generation we will have a different ecosystem.
Susan Sharma: The decision to kill a bear is taken by the wildlife dept?
John H. Eickert: Yes, the wildlife department makes that decision. And yes, the continuous overburden created by man's needs overshadows those of the bears in Montana or the elephant in India.
ash: Susan it the fight so some humans give life initially and then when the animals do not (listen)
ash: it has to be smothered
ash: somethered means - food and space
ash: not provided
ash: and then called intruder!
ritu sharma: but again as john said it is linked to the ecosystem, any change in it will have impact..
ash: so we all the humans have to think over - who is the intruder
Rohit Pansare: In case of a natural system thats deteriorating the animals would relocate to better areas but now either there arent any such areas left or the animals are forced to adapt to human interventions..
Rohit Pansare: Ive heard bears often forage for food in garbage bins in cities..
ash: anyone can enlighten about the elephant conflict areas
ritu sharma: it is on rise in karnataka
rohit: hey guys...
rohit: good to see so many folks
Shashi Kant Sharma: In parts of India, Indo-Nepal border as also South India, most places, with humans building inside forests, we have not only reduced forest cover, we have also made it impossible for the Elephants to migrate to adjoining areas by cutting off corridors
ash: what does elephant need?
ash: Dense forest
rohit: like sigur platuea problem in TN
ash: water resorce
Shashi Kant Sharma: Oh the elephant needs lots of fodder, undisturbed existence, lots of water, ability to move over large areas
rohit: all resorts blocking corridors
Rohit Pansare: The average area required for a herd of elephants including their migration areas must be huge
Shashi Kant Sharma: sure considering the huge appetite the elephant has
Susan Sharma: Can we imagine a world without wild elephants?
Rohit Pansare: the largest mammals on land.....impossible..
rohit: we can imagine..but cant live with !!
Shashi Kant Sharma: Even as we become aware of the issues involved and find it impossible to rehabilitate forests that we have destroyed, experts need to identify old migration routes of animals and secure these for 'exclusive' use of elephants
ash: YES exclusive use
rohit: @shashi may how old u are reffering
rohit: @sashi may i know..
John H. Eickert: Yes, old migration routes are important but perhaps some no longer exist and others might not be able to support the 300-350 pounds of forage each elephant needs each day.
ash: old i feel is where the elephants were comfortable
Rohit Pansare: Designing cities such that these routes are not disturbed or an alternative is created...is very important cause just like u cant stop a elephant...u cant stop a city from growing
John H. Eickert: You can't stop a city from growing but you can stop it from sprawling across the landscape.
rohit: yup....sustainable development
ash: @Rohit but we as humans can adjust but the animals can't
Shashi Kant Sharma: Those corridors have been used by elephants for ages, I believe.A world without animals really will mean one without green cover, forests, and hence rain, sounds like a recipe for will man survive.
Shashi Kant Sharma: I meant a formula for destroying more than just the green cover/animals
Rohit Pansare: @john absolutely...In india though sprawl is considered development....
ash: we have to conserve the eco system for everyones existance
rohit: @ash this quite radical statement for some, which might block the ways we can find to balance the two things..development and conservation
John H. Eickert: Mark Plotkin, PHD once theorized that unless humanity learns to control itself then the natural world will be comprised of rats, cockroaches and pidgeons.
Shashi Kant Sharma: Sure responsible use of natural resources is the first step towards achieving harmony
ritu sharma: elephants expand their range ....increase in human activity increases the conflicts..
Susan Sharma: When elephants disappear from the wild, forests will disappear.
rohit: @ritu plz i think , i wont agree with u...
rohit: @wud u plz lemme know how they expand thier
Shashi Kant Sharma: Elephants need to expand their range when they run short of fodder/space to form and support their on social groups
rohit: @ritu ..range
ritu sharma: on which point?
rohit: ohh....
rohit: shashi kant did it..
Rohit Pansare: many sprawl control measures talk of green corridors...that allow movement of wildlife...not sure how far these are effective
rohit: thanx nyways...
ash: anyone here who has got involved with the elephants directly
Shashi Kant Sharma: I believe travelling from Bangaluru to Kochi by Road that cuts through pristine forest is a good example of not only how we disturb animals but also how we initiate conflict
Rohit Pansare: Wouldnt fragmentation of habitat be a bigger problem...with roads and rails cutting accross habitata..
rohit: any solutions wud be welcome to these roads and railways...
rohit: apart from the proposed highways
rohit: really ajoke on conservation
Rohit Pansare: similar case is in GIR santuary with asiatic lions
Susan Sharma: Forest dept has been trying to open a corridoor betn Rajaji and Corbett for years.
rohit: saw a initiative of WTI , where they did gr8 work to reduce deaths on tracks in corbett..apart from convincing authorities to go round the park
Shashi Kant Sharma: Gir does have a problem of too little space for all the lions but the governments of adjoining states have been quibbling about providing these lions some alternative space to live comfortably
Susan Sharma: Similarly one betn Nepal and Corbett, Here elephants are victim to Political borders
rohit: they cleard the vegetation around tight corners to help train drivers
ash: all the human made borders are a problems for the animals also
Susan Sharma: @Rohit that is a good practical solution
rohit: this is one part..wait lemme see the link if i have it....
rohit: its on youtube..
Shashi Kant Sharma: Yeah thank God for those minor mercies too - that corridor killed over 20 elephants over the lat 18 months, as reported about 2 months back
Susan Sharma: I guess a top down and bottom up approach is needed for saving the elephants.
ash: if their is a conflict zone we have to have a solution
ash: and more conducive to these creatures
Rohit Pansare: wud anyone be knowing about any solutions that have worked...kind of documented success stories..
rohit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mBXToOFUfKY
rohit: here u go
Shashi Kant Sharma: It would appear that people around the forests/wildlife corridors who have lived with these animals for generations, will need to lead this/get involved
rohit: its a documentry like
rohit: 3 parts of this video i think
Susan Sharma: Thanks, Rohit
rohit: :)
ash: rohit thanks
rohit: regarding locals i think they have manymore issues which need their attention..
Susan Sharma: a report by Ankur Chaturvedi can be read at http://www.indianwildlifeclub.com/ResearchPapers/Human-Elephant-Conflict.aspx
rohit: its we urbanites who do PHDs in conservaton can talk in details with research papers in hand..
Shashi Kant Sharma: For sure but the most practical solutions generally emerge from brainstorming with those at grass root
rohit: really we need to move masses from cities
rohit: who are really consumers
ash: the conflict points on the ground has to be handled
ash: we have to give way to them
Rohit Pansare: thanks rohit & susan for the links
Susan Sharma: Ankur Chaturvedi is a tea planter who experienced conflict first hand
ash: i have seen a number of places of conflict in dehradun and around
ash: this conflict area is very old
ash: a number of accidents
Susan Sharma: I believe the Africans have managed their conflict situations well may be we can learn from them too.
ritu sharma: we had a recent case in karnataka where elephant attacked a man who went close to herd with camera
ash: with the humans growing mentally and developing, why cna't we have an underground system in the conflict zone
Susan Sharma: Ash, that is an idea worth exploring!
Susan Sharma: an underpass for elephants
ash: may be for our move paths
John H. Eickert: Or an overpass, elephants are very intelligent
Susan Sharma: John and others , can we sum up this interesting discussion? Thanks to all participants
ash: just have a look at this link https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10150891511688316.413790.614433315&type=1&l=2877dde1e4
ash: the humans do not react before the problems start
John H. Eickert: Thanks to all, I learned a lot today.
ash: its only after the broblem has multiplyed
ash: very very nice interaction with alll
ash: huge learning
Shashi Kant Sharma: Thanks every one it was nice interacting with this group. lots to learn/think about
ritu sharma: it was a good session...thanks to all...
rohit: thanks guys we need people like u go forward...
Susan Sharma: Ash the link shows Sukhna lake
ash: yes susan but the point what i want to make is that we react after the problem
rohit: thanx susan
rohit: thanx ash fo rlink
Susan Sharma: Let us keep talking- Teamwork can achieve the impossible
rohit: yup sure..
Shashi Kant Sharma: Sure look how well a mahout and elephant team up
ash: Thanks all
rohit: see guys next time..
Susan Sharma: So, good night everyone (have a great day John!)